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Mark Wright's avatar

Good post Helen. If I'm honest you could have saved a lot of effort by just noting - correctly - that Mehdi Hasan is a bad-faith-debating obnoxious arsehole and has been for decades, and leaving it at that. However, I salute your desire to be through and academic.

Grow Some Labia's avatar

Well-spoken, Helen. It's appalling to many of us liberals that progressives support, outwardly or tacitly, Islamofascist regimes like Iran and Hamas, yet fail consistently to support women and gays and transfolk persecuted by these regimes. The fact that Muslim men lost their minds over the images of so-called hijab-supporters wearing AI'ed hijabs exposes the real purpose of hijabs: To teach Muslim women 'their place' and perpetuate the oppression by sexually insecure males.

It reminds me of an argument I had with an Orthodox Jew many years ago on Usenet. At that time, Jewish women in Jerusalem were protesting the historical banning of women from praying at the Western Wall. We libs supported the women while Louis argued against it; he claimed it wasn't 'discrimination' and that they were protesting a tradition that 'respects' the two sexes' 'right' to pray in their own space. They clearly don't agree with you, I pointed out, since they want to pray there and Orthodox Jews won't let them. They disagree with you that it isn't discrimination; why aren't you listening to them? What's it to you if they pray there, too?

He didn't have a good answer for that, he just said that 'different' isn't he same as 'discrimination'. I pointed out that if one side feels discriminated against, and doesn't buy your argument, then it isn't over.

I pointed out that like conservative Muslims, Orthodox Jews keep the sexes strictly segregated as a woman's voice and presence is considered sexually arousing, and prevents men from keeping their minds on God. And that if men can't control their thoughts, Jewish or Muslim, perhaps only women should be allowed to pray at the wall until the boys grow up and take responsibility for their own minds.

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